Hot melt on carbons

[fnshtr]

3 rivers says to not use hot melt glue on carbon shafts. Like I posted before, I used hot melt for a long time. Someone suggested the high impact gorilla glue and it works great.

However, I have never attempted to remove inserts glued in with that type of glue. I've never needed to yet! Could be a problem.

[Ray Lyon]

I've never had a problem with the cylinder block hot melt glue from Kustom King  (same as big Jim's ) on my Easton Axis and aluminum or brass inserts. I don't do any prep.  Just warm the glue and put a little dab around the bottom of the insert (it will spread up the insert as it goes in the shaft) and warm the insert just enough to soften the glue.  Push in with the little plastic green tool from Easton and leave the shaft lying horizontally until it cools. If I'm getting some excess glue towards the top of the insert as its going in i wipe it off BEFORE the insert is completely in the shaft.  
I've done this for years since Easton Axis shafts first came out.

[Doc Nock]

Thanks, Ray.

Thanks, fnshtr.

Removal o f those expensive 100 gr. brass inserts is a priority for me...

I even have used hot melt to affix "over-footing" to lighter wall target carbon to improve behind the head impact resistance.

I totally flattened a field point overshooting a creek gator shot and blew the nock out.  I checked that arrow at home and it was dollar sound and the glue never let loose.

With all the variances, I have to continue to believe (can't prove) there are many different glue type formulas out there... and lucking into the right one is paramount.

As for heating carbons, if I were making or selling carbons, I'd say the same thing...as one poster pointed out, done to a bit of excess, you'll have a rubber arrow that droops or corkscrews from softening.

Since I've shot the same arrows for several years under all sorts of conditions, I have trouble believe judicious use of heat on a field point, removing insert quickly and cooling the shaft, has created any weaknesses.  The way I shoot and mmisss...I'd think I'd be breaking arrows. I lose a few, haven't broken them...  

Neat thread to see such varied experiences with different products...I notice references to locally bought on some items, thus leading me to believe there are a lot of variances in products used...

[Possum Head]

Not everyone has sense enough to keep their feet out from under push mowers so instead of telling them "hey you dont wanna do that" let's just jack the cost of the mower up and apply a handle lever. The little flashing man on your Toyota dashboard aint enough let's add 50 friggin dings to it so the owner can enjoy it while he goes to check his mail(he'll pay for the add on). What these carbon shaft manufacturers wont tell you is, it's o.k. to apply enough heat to soften the glue and then back off. In doing so, some moron
would roast weenies on it at the hunting camp and later while shooting at game with it wonder why he ended up with a hand full of carbon fiber.       Arrow makers are interested in selling you your next dozen arrows period. They dont care that hot melt is your choice for an adhesive. They would rather you choose an alternative glue than go through the motions of
helping you properly use a product they dont offer.

[Possum Head]

That does it. I'm quitting hot melt. I just learned that with enough heat you can destroy carbon, wood, cane, and aluminum.

[Bullfrog 1]

The only issues I have had is on Gold Tips for some reason. I don't think the inserts fit as tight as some of the other shafts. I use Big Jims on Beman Centershots and have never had one come out.  Bill

[imbowhunt10]

X2 on Big Jims hot melt. I used to use epoxy.

[Zradix]

Originally posted by ammoeater:
I always swab the inside of the arrow with a Q-tip dipped in rubbing alcohol, and then scuff it up with a brass rifle bore brush.  Works well for me.

Me too.. no problems at all.
I just use industrial glue sticks...we have em at work for glueing boxes together.

I do use an alcohol flame for melting...no soot that way.

also, when removing the insert I screw in a field point and heat the point just till the insert gets warm enough to soften the glue enough to remove.

[widow sax]

Big Jims hot melt wont use anything else! I have embedded them into wood that took two of use to pull out and insert stays in fine. I also clean the inside of my shafts.     Widow

[Butch Speer]

Originally posted by MO Bow:
scratch up the insude of the shaft
clean with acetone before glueing

i don't use the stuff made for archery any more...i use the softer craft store hot glue-gun glue.  works perfectly and haven't had an insert come out.  i've had issues with ferr-l-tite and other products from being a little too brittle.  had a lot of issues with inserts or points (on woodies) coming off in cold weather.

a lot cheaper too...you can get a lifetime supply for $5

X2 I think most peoples problem is not getting the insert hot enough. It needs to melt and run freely on the insert.

[Zradix]

X3....I think most peoples problem is not getting the insert hot enough. It needs to melt and run freely on the insert.
   

[bowhuntingrn]

I use an appropriate sized bore brush (depending on shaft diameter) to scuff up the inside of the shaft and a little sandpaper or sanding sponge on the inserts (aluminum or brass). Clean all of the above with 91% rubbing alcohol. I use an insert tool just because I find it easier than using a field tip. Heat the insert with a pocket torch until it is hot enough to melt the glue and insert quickly. I hold it in place for about 12 - 15 seconds and then place in room temperature glass of water. The glue is Bohning Ferr-L-Tite Cool Flex (the blue stick). I use it because it is available locally. it is far more flexible than standard amber Ferr-L-Tite. I've used the same glue with steel points on woodies. Was at a tournament that had targets that were "eating" points off all the other shooters wood shafts, but my wife, son, and myself never lost one. That's good enough for me.

[Msbow]

I've never had any problems using hot melt glue when I sanded the inserts and inside of the shafts then rub everything down good with denatured alcohol.

If you use gorilla super glue, you will NOT be able to remove the insert without destroying the shaft. That has been my experience with using gorilla super glue for gluing inserts and then trying to remove them.

[Longbow58]

Big Jim's. All I use anymore.

[BigJim]

Although most hot melt might work, it is not all created equal.  When testing the glues that were sent to us for samples, some failed badly even though they looked nearly the same.

When I do my shafts, I never clean or prep but I also don't cut as they need to be full length.
I just heat the glue with a propane torch and roll the bottom quarter inch or so of insert in glue and set aside until I'm done with all inserts.  I then reheat them one at a time and insert In shaft. They should be heated enough so they slide all the way in without trouble. If they get stiff before they bottom out and you force it, you will probably loose that one.
Good luck, bigjim