Tents or Tarp Tent. Need advice.

[Stixbowdrew]

I am torn... I understand the benefits of a regular tent with a floor such as a Kelly gunisson or Big Agnes Seedhouse. So someone please explain to me why a floorless shelter such as a Kifaru Sawtooth would be a step down? I love the idea of tarp (bivy) camping and I am headed to Colorados flattops next September for elk, would be packing in for 10 days give or take.

So please let me know some of the benefits or downfalls

Thanks,

Drew

[Archer1977]

Thought about a hammock? I got one because it seems nearly impossible to find flat ground in Colorado, lol! You can get a hennessy hammock geared up to set up and tear down really quick.

[Montanawidower]

The biggest benefit of a floorless tent is you can pee inside....  

[Budget Bowman]

I second to hammock idea. Mine packs up smaller than the size of a cantelope with all the rope necessary to string it up. It's lightweight and comfortable. I prefer it over an air mattress. Not sure what kind of weather you might run into but if it's too cold (below freezing) they do get a little breezy.

[JimB]

Tents with a fly like the big Agnes can be closed up to shut out wind without the condensation that you would get from an impermeable wall,closed up like that.This can be considerable if a cold front moves in,with high winds.Keeping the wind off can help you feel 10 degrees warmer.They can also be completely closed to keep out mosquitoes.This may be may not be an issue during elk season at some altitude but after purchasing a tent,you may find you want to use it at other times-fishing trips etc.

You can't cook from a hammock or get dressed in it during a rainstorm.

I prefer a compact,light tent with fly that I can get my bow in and my pack at least under the rainfly,with the ability to cook from if needed.

My current one is an MSR Zoid 1 (no longer made)which also has the option of a "fast and light pitch" which is where you leave the tent body behind and pitch the fly with a "footprint" for a floor.This setup won't keep the bugs or wind off but only weighs about 1.5 lbs.

The tarp can work well,be lighter and less expensive but if you close it up tight,there can be considerable condensation on the inside,especially with more than one person,so you want to keep your sleeping bag from rubbing the walls.Some dripping may occur and it won't be a lot of fun in a buggy area if you want to also use it during those times.

[Jarrod Reno]

Check out 'Seek Outside'.

I picked up their Lil Bug Out this year and am absolutely loving it. Its very versatile.

I can use just the base as a half pyramid when going solo... throw in the 2 person nest when my wife goes and she doesnt want to worry about bugs... I can attatch the vestibule and have a door or two open... or completely close it.

The venting is great and if its going to be a warm night... Im camped in a valley...etc... and Im nervous about condensation... I pitch it with a couple of the corners lifted off the ground to get some air underneath.

Also I've got a stove jack and will be running an Ed T's titanium wood burning stove for an October hunt.

Search the threads on Rokslide, there are tons of threads regarding tarp/tipi set ups.

[Nantahala Nut]

I don't have much experience with tarp tents but I do have some experience with lightweight tents.  I spent three months hiking the Appalachian Trail and I would swear by my tent.  It was a Eureka Spitfire 1 man tent.  They make a two man that is a little bigger and of course heavier.  My Spitfire weighed less than two pounds and set up quick.  It never leaked and it was big enough that I could pull my pack in if need be but most of the time I kept it inside the fly but outside the tent.  I lived in that thing for three months and it was great.  

You are gonna have a lot of weight packing for ten days.  I would look for lightweight backpackers gear for your tent and sleeping bag.  Message me or post here if you have any questions about backpacking gear.  I spent a lot of time obsessing over it.

[Biathlonman]

Biggest benefit with floor less if that you can run a wood stove. I'll run a sawtooth with wood stove when I think the weather is going to be bad and usually a Tarptent Contrail when the weather looks ok.

[Matty]

I think if you HAD TO choose ONE IT WOULD BE A LIGHT WEIGHT BACKPACKING TENT. .  All the examples above are valid for all situations.  But again choosing just 1 the tent is it in my opinion. One of the biggest things about not having a floor. Is keeping out rain , mud, just being clean I can lay my clothes or gear on the tent floor and it's just as clean as my living room floor. Others may not but I find it (clean) important. There's always bugs ANTS etc. And there absolutely ARE Mosquitos at high alt. in sept. We are currently sporting a few bites to prove that from last weeks hunt. My current "Go to" is the Big Agnes fly creek UL 2.
The 2 is for 2 people there's a 1 also. But the 2 is under 3 lbs and packs way small. If I hunt alone I have plenty of room inside for ALL of my gear. If Julie comes along its enough for 2 people Plus clothes. Packs under the vestibule.
Good luck

[M60gunner]

IMO Matty sums it up to a tee. I spent many nights in various kinds of tents, homemade shelters, bivi bags, and other thrown together shelters. The most important consideration besides weight is are you going to be dry and will you get a good nights sleep? I tended to skimp on other things so I slept warm and dry.

[MnFn]

Good points Matt.  I am always amazed at the amount of ants I see when sitting around int the Colorado Mtns during elk hunting.  Also had a few night when it got downright cold at night.

[Orion]

I like a floor in a tent, and have one in my wall tent, but it can add as much weight as the tent in a backpack set up. That's why I use a Kifaru T-pee for packing in where weight is important.  Can put a stove in it when weather gets bad, which it usually does for at least a few days in a 10-day stretch.

Bring wood, your boots, or anything else inside a tent and you soon have a dirty floor.  If there's nothing there but grass and earth to start with, it's not noticeable. In fact, if you set up in an area with a little vegetation, any dirt you bring into the tent/tarp tends to work its way into the grass so the surface remains somewhat cleaner. Of course, I do use a light ground cloth under my sleeping pad and bag.

[bowbert]

I've spent 5 seasons guiding, and 15 seasons hunting in the high country of CO in a floorless wall tent.  But now I use a tigoat floorless tipi with a small wood stove.  I don't have to carry in fuel to cook (all is done on the stove with finger sized wood) and the 7 man tipi/stove weigh about 7 pounds.  Enough for 3 guys backpacking and gear.

As for condensation, I used this set up on Afognak Island (north end of Kodiak) for Sitka blacktails when it rained every day for several hours each day.  I had a small drop cloth for my bag and clothes, and the rest of the floor was open.  We did get condensation, but when you run the stove it isn't an issue at all...and I was able to dry gear out.

One thing to consider is that this system allows you to stay warm.  My last elk hunt was late September at 11k ft.  We dried gear and were able to heat the tent to...how hot do you want it...which is a real luxury for an extended hunt in bad weather.

I won't ever use a floor'd tent for extented trips again.  It's not for everyone, but if you want to go light with maximum comfort in any conditions its tops IMHO.

Bret

[old_goat2]

I just did my first trip up with my Sawtooth, it rained a couple hours first night, only has wet ground in a couple of inches from the edge and didn't have the mess on the floor that is usually associated with a floored tent from muddy boots etc.. I didn't take the stove with me, was wishing I had it to help alleviate the condensation but I was trying to keep the weight down because I was already hauling in a ton of stuff and stashing it for later in the season when my wife goes up with me. After one trip I really like the no floor, I did bring a tyvek tarp to put down to stand on while getting dressed. I've read and it makes sense, if you use a ground tarp with floorless shelter, it should be smaller than the tent footprint to keep water from puddling in. In a major major rain event, they all suck.

[bowbert]

Let me add that a single wall tipi will/does accumulate condensation no matter what.  Some climates are worse than others.  But if you understand that it is completely managable.

[Gehrke145]

I just got a tarp tent double rainbow and love it, its a great happy medium.

[Jakeemt]

I will second the hammock super light and very comfortable. Add a decent rain fly or tarp and a good sleeping bag and you are set. I have have camped in one down to 24 degrees and slept like a baby. I drool over those henssey's but as of now out of the budget. I have a cheap in from Walmart, a painters tarp, and a down bag. Tarp and hammock costs me 20 bucks combined most expensive was the bag.

[longbowray]

This is my tent trap I use .

[PistolPete]

Regular tents are just too bulky and heavy. I was using a GoLite SL3 tipi which was great, but I'm going to move to a tarp and bivy next year to save even more weight.

A tarp-tent is a great option though, but if you do go with one, make sure you can figure a way to use your trekking poles (which you will NEED) as the setup poles for the tent, thus saving another half pound and bulk of a pole just for the tent.

Also, I've never had bug problems with my SL3.

[njloco]

I've had a Sawtooth for a while now and have camped in some extreme weather. I never, never go anyplace with out the wood stove, you can't beat it ! Rain ?, are you kidding me, I have been in down pours, never had a any water come in under or over, but common sense will tell you not to set up in a low spot.

I have never gotten bit by any bugs yet! I do carry one of those light weight bugnets, I hang it from the laundry line and drape it over my sleeping bag, works great.

I use a hammock that has many uses, it can be used as a tarp (in case I want to spike out), additional protection for the outside if the weather comes in,  but it can also be used as a partial floor inside the tent, mud or dirt is NOT a factor at all.

Good luck !
   

No stove in this picture, but this thing is caverness !