Why is 10 different than 30?

[bear bowman]

I've been thinking about this a lot. I know there are quite a few guys and gals on here that can shoot very proficiently out to very long distances.
What I want to know is why guys like myself can shoot well to 20 and then walk back to 30 or more and fall apart? The shot is the same, just longer. Form should be the same.
I'm thinking that form issues are one reason. I also think that your mind plays games with me also. My number one reason, for me at least, is my vision. When I can see what I want to hit crisp and clear, I seem to shoot better. I can't see as well at those longer distances.
So what are your thoughts? Why with all else being equal do we not shoot as well at longer distances?

[mcgroundstalker]

We tend to see things in shapes... A car, stop sign and a 3D target... What happens at 30 yards is you may not be able to "pick-a-spot" because you are looking at the whole target. That will cause you to shoot high or low.

Try to imagine a poker chip or LED light blinking where you want your arrow to go... Other times you can "become the arrow" and imagine its' flight into the kill zone... Takes practice, but works for me...

... mike ...        ...

[KAZ]

Vision/focus all lead to the ability to pick a finite slot amongst distractions that grow with distance. If you can't see/focus on a specific spot you will not be accurate. Secondly, the mental war increases as a result of less confidence which breaks down form to some degree. For some, the form collapse completely falls apart... Just my two quick cents.

[Longbowwally]

I agree with what the others have posted and also the longer shot distance magnifies any issues with the release, form, etc….

[macbow]

Totally agree it starts with vision.
Once it is hard to see a small spot the mental focus deteriorates.  
One way to practice is to shoot with a friend and compete trading shots on leafs etc at longer distances.
What I mean is practice focusing on small spots farther out and not on your regular 3D target.

[Fritz]

I agree with the others. I will add that lack of focus and problems in form are more magnified the greater the distance.

[Sam McMichael]

In addition to what has already been said, I think there is another factor. We have all shot a lot more arrows from 20 yards than from 30. This means we have a lot more muscle memory built up for the shorter distance. Therefore that "feels right" sensation, (which is a related part of the whole focus process) is not as prominent at 30 yards.

[DanielB89]

I find the farther away I go, the harder I have to focus.  Form is also a lot more critical at longer ranges.  I can get away with a sloppy release or not holding my bow arm on target at 25 and under relatively easy.  at 30+, I will struggle if I don't do everything perfect and even then, I struggle. lol.

[dbd870]

Vision/focus all the way. Once you can't pick a spot on the target it's game over.

[ChuckC]

In my mind, several things happen.

First, a half inch off at ten yards can be a LOT off at longer ranges, just like any projectile.

Second,  As you get farther, it is more difficult to accurately assess yardage AND it becomes more critical due to the rapid drop in flight path.

Third, I can see pretty well at ten yards and can pick a small spot to aim at.  At twenty it is more difficult and at longer distances yet, it gets to the point where I cannot do that and shoot at an area, not a hair.  Built in inaccuracy.

If your eyes are awesome ( mine were) you can do it farther than most.  
ChuckC

[Doc Nock]

Any errors that we make in form, follow-thru or distance estimation, are magnified by what...30% between 20 and 30 yards????

a 6" group at 20 yards would then open up to _______ group at 30... (I'll leave those type calculations to the math majors)

On live targets, arrow flight time leaves that much more time for the animal to move or turn... adding to the risk.  Target at 30 is fine, but there are plenty of skilled game shooters at 30 and beyond. I Just not be one of them!

I can't see tiny twigs between me and the critter that might cause a deflection. Add it all together and I just don't shoot that far, but some  of my Western associates/friends would never shoot if they limited to my range Comfort!

[John146]

You will see in this picture an orange dot on the inside of my bow. I put it there to remind me to "place" that orange dot where I want to hit IF I can't find a spot to focus on.

Low light, smooth fur, etc. are all reasons that a spot may not be evident to really focus on. Like many, my vision is not like it used to be so I use this a lot more now than before. This is just a sticker and the location on my limb makes it easy to glance at and then transfer that "image" to the animal or target. Of course, you have to remember to do it. May help you at 30 yards.

Chuck Adams would do this mental image when he shot at animals at longer distances.

 

[DanielB89]

Todd,
I have never thought about that.  I may have to try that out.

[Daz]

Folks talk about practicing at 30 to be stone cold killers at 20 and under. If you want to be proficient at 30, practice to 40-50. There is also the descending scale of poor practice and re-enforcing bad form/shot sequence.

Rather than shooting 30 poor or marginal arrows at 30, break up practicing (if you can) to 3 sessions of 10 arrows with more focus and intent.

As i typed the above i realized that the one thing that is rarely discussed is the ability to practice to longer distances regularly (those of us that live in rural areas that can shoot daily if we wish). A lot harder when you live somewhere that you have to drive a half hour to shoot.

[tippit]

I find shooting targets and foam animals do the same thing for me beyond 20 yards.  What I shoot at our farm is water bottles scattered in the field.  Even when hidden, I'll see the glint of light off the bottle much like seeing an animals eye. I'm always amazed how well I shoot even out to 40 yards...tippit

[damascusdave]

I shoot well enough which is all I care about...the less I analyze how I shoot the better I shoot

DDave

[Tradcat]

My eyesight has really declined in the last few years and that coupled with a lack of concentration has caused my long distance shooting to suffer. Here's where it gets crazy... 18 yards and under, I'm pretty consistent. If I take two big steps to 20 yards, my shooting goes to pieces. Don't get me wrong here, I will ocassionally make a good shot from 20 yards, but not enough that I have confidence 100% of the time to shoot at an animal

[DaveT1963]

When I want to shoot well at thirty I start practicing (stump shooting for me) a lot from 50-80 yards.  The reason I think most shot poorly at 30 is because that is where they have set their upper limit and they KNOW it.  They seldom devote much time to shooting longer ranges and perfecting the form to do so.  The mind is pretty powerful.  After a month of shooting 50-60 yard shots (as long as you are not just flinging them)  I guarantee you that your mind will look at 30 and say I got that easy. Long range shooting will also help build better form and consistency if done right.

I do agree with vision as well.  My evening vision is getting worse as I get older and I now require glasses during the magic time - and they have made a big difference.

[ron w]

There is no difference ........you were off 1/4" at 10 yards but with 3 arrows it looks like a nice group.......at 30 yards were off just as much but 1/4" looks like 10" and therefore no group.

[VA Elite]

I can't shoot dots to save my life. I could not even do it when shooting a compound. I just shoot at vitals on 3d target mostly.